What is going on

[jmcole22]

Where have the morals gone? Pregnant cadet allowed to stay in school and attend classes until time for the birth? The father was kicked out, but she got to stay???? The female cadet who posted nude pictures of herself on the internet? She has been charged with several Honor Violations, but remained at the school? Seems to me that promotes acceptance of single parents, premarital sex among cadets, and tolerance when the outcome is pregnancy.

It seems that The Citadel has turned its back on the morals it once taught cadets. No more prayer? Wasnt spirtuality part of the whole man, oops, whole person concept. Oh wait, that was taken out and replaced with Character Development.

I am ashamed of my alma mater. The school is doing a tap dance to avoid another lawsuit by giving up its core values.

Any other thoughts on this????:rant:

[TRAPASAURUS REX]

As a man and war veteran I have some thoughts on this. For years women have been ridiculed because THEY got pregnant and the physical evidence was there for all to see. But the guy could deny he was the father and received the benefit of the doubt most times. So I think it is great that the girl gets to stay in school and finish her education so she can at least have a chance at supporting herself and her child.
The last thing we need to go back to is ridicule and shame when a women becomes pregnant out of wedlock(thank GOD those days are gone).
I wouldn't be ashamed of your alma mater because it is being tolerant be ashamed of the arrogant as-s h-les it turns out on the world when they graduate. Don't get me wrong I am pro military but I could give a rats as-s for the citadel. When I was in the military the biggest as-s holes I met were (you guessed it) the citadel graduates. I had the good fortune of seeing one arrogant lieutenant from the citadel get his as-s ripped by a female major because he didn't show her the proper respect due her rank- it was a beautiful thing.
The citadel has for years been "steeped" in tradition (Good ol' boy racism) and finally the past decade it is being dragged kicking and screaming into the modern world and it is a beautiful thing.

[Mad Max]

This is what happens when we let a bunch of northern girly men invade us again.

Ya'll know why the souths so windy? cuz the north SuCkS.

[jmcole22]

Then I guess I happen to be of those arrogant a-holes you are refering to. It is funny you mention that since The Citadel is noted by the military for turning out good officers that become great leaders. Just sounds like jealousy on your part that you didnt get to attend! The Citadel has repeatedly ranked in the top 10 Universities and Colleges by Newsweek. The Citadel was recently ranked number one for their four year graduation rate. Shall I continue??

Trap Rex, you are commenting on things which you know nothing about. I am not belittling women, I am saying that The Citadel should not have let her stay there during her pregnancy. She should have returned after the child was born. When I was a cadet, you were not allowed to be married, nor have any dependants. She got around this by giving up custody of the child to the father, who was kicked out due to the pregnancy. How does that make sense??? She happens to also be the one who took the nude photos of the other famale cadet. These two females have a long record of unacceptable behavior. If a male cadet didnt half the things they did, he would have been kicked out long ago. The fact is the school is trying to avoid another lawsuit.

The arguement for women to attend The Citadel was based on state funding. Their taxes were paying for something they did not get to benefit from. Well guess what....most of our taxes go to things we do not benefit from. What about my right as a tax-payer to receive a public single-gender education? I pay just as much tax as they do, why do their wants come before mine? The popular public opinion is that women should not be there. People like you who know nothing about the school have no idea what was ruined. If you look at the demographics of women at The Citadel, the majority of them are from the north. Very few women from S.C or the south are attending. That demonstrates how us Carolinians feel about OUR Corps of Cadets.

I also happen to be an Army officer. I have women under my command. I treat each soldier fairly, and do not base them on their gender, rather if they can get the job done in a professional manner.

Answer me this. If women want to benefit from what The Citadel has to offer, and they want equal rights to attend The Citadel, then why do we have different rules for the female cadet than the male cadets? All female cadets have locks on their doors, the males do not. All females have blinds on their windows, the males do not. Here is the bottom line....the famales want to attend The Citadel, but do not want to follow the same rules or be treated like the male cadets. Equality, without equality......right?

[TRAPASAURUS REX]

I wouldn't have gone to the Citadel if they had given me a full ride. I went to and graduated from the only CAROLINA and that is the University of North Carolina - a far better all around school than the Citadel. As far as the Citadel's graduation rate I would hope a military college whose goal it is to turn out just one type of student-military officers (Yeah I know you have night classes but they are not in the "Corp") would graduate >90% of its cadets. You can't cut classes at the citadel whenever you want or there is going to be disciplinary action. Now if all schools had the same rules regarding class attendance as the Citadel you would see graduation rates soar so la-de-da.
As for different rules for females and males. Last time I was in the military there were different rules for males and females (combat zone, physical training test). But we all had the same codes of conduct.
I guess the females have to have blinds on the windows and locks on the doors because the male cadets would lose their military bearing if they got a look at a boobie and then whine and complain that if the females weren't there they wouldn't be losing their military bearing.
As for that females conduct, if the Citadel is "trying to avoid another lawsuit" (to quote you) then your problem is with the Citadel (not with the females) for not having any balls and upholding standards. If a cadet's conduct is detrimental then you go through the "process" and get rid of them (easier said than done).
But whining about equality and you being an Army officer-get real! You obviously can't be in a combat unit and be whining about equality - because there ain't none in combat- you get the job done with what you brought and who you brought to the game.
To answer your question as to why there are different rules for female cadets than there are for male cadets. It is simple. Females have vaginas and estrogen and males (at least most) have penises and testosterone. And because of those differences and those alone when females wanted the RIGHT to attend a state supported school there was much gnashing of teeth and crying and whining about how the females were going to ruin the cadet corp just by their physical presence.
So under the tremendous uproar and pressure that even most male cadets would've quit the first female cadet quit and the citadel received a lot of negative publicity and a lawsuit for being such as-sholes.
So now they have to handle subsequent feamale cadets with a different pair of gloves than they do the male cadets.
If a male cadet can not exercise enough self-restraint, focus, and militry bearing to keep his ****** out of the cadet corp then his as-s needs to be drummed out.
As for the females you mentioned,their conduct at the Citadel probably will be an indicator for their future conduct and GOD help them if they get into the REAL military because rank in the officer corp is very competitive as you know and they will probably have short careers.

[jmcole22]

"If a male cadet can not exercise enough self-restraint, focus, and military bearing to keep his ****** out of the cadet corp then his as-s needs to be drummed out." Well Trap Rex, that is exactly what happened. But the last time I checked, it takes two to make a baby...so does your comment apply to women who cannot keep their legs closed within the Corps of Cadets?

Again you made comments on something which you still know nothing about. It is not the goal of The Citadel to turn out only military officers. Only about 30-35% of cadets commission into the military. The goal of The Citadel is to produce productive members of society, which I must say is something this country is lacking!!

As far as the "first female" is concerned, and Im sure you are referring to Shannon Faulkner, she deserved every bit of ridicule she received. It is a disgrace to drag the good name of a great school through the mud, and then fail. Her motivation was recognition and $$$$. If she truly wanted to be a cadet, she would not have showed up her first day weighing 190 pounds. She received her two hours of glory before realizing she was somewhere she really didnt belong. On the same note, lets mention the first female graduate, Nancy Mace. Did you know her father was appointed the Commandant while she attended The Citadel. Do you think her motivation was pure??? No. She attended summer school and took an overload of classes to ensure she would graduate a year earlier than her other female classmates. She is now making money off of a book about her experience as a cadet. How hard could it be with daddy watching over you.

If you look at a breakdown of the Corps, you will see that only 5% is female. That alone shows that many females agree with my arguement. Please dont make the assumption that I am a woman hater. I have a beautiful wife and daughter. I respect the role that women possess in today's society. I just dont think they belong at THE CITADEL!

P.S. Trap Rex, are you a card toting member of the ACLU????? lol

[Patrick Henry]

The sad thing of it is, the Uniform Code of Military Justice metes out criminal penalties for the same thing.

The old foundation of the Corps of Cadets, before the state legislature turned its back on it (like pracitcally every other responsibility it has), was the "Whole Man" concept. This was illustrated as the four legs that support a table, with the legs being: Spiritual Growth, Academic Development, Physical Fitness, and Military Service. You know, the military service part before the Clintons made it Meals on Wheels in BDU's, used to be a pretty important part of it.

The Corps of Cadets was its own brotherhood. There was no white, black, or anything else but GREY. Those who were "not accepted" did so by isolating themselves. Graduation from there was a individual and GROUP effort.

Yeah, I have led soldiers in combat, and had to follow a few jerks, too. Most of the "jerks" were ROTC frat boys from "Slippery Rock University." These were the folks whose only exposure to leadership were the counseling statements they got after being woefully prepared between keggers and weekends.

As for folks that hate the place, I have since given up on delivering rational arguments to the most irrational of all emotions: hatred.

Maybe if The Citadel offered a degree program in Video Poker Management, Vote Buying, Racial Gerrymandering, or had a big moneymaking football program, maybe the General Assembly would not have so easily turned its back?

[jmcole22]

Bravo Patrick. That was the point I was trying to portray, not go off on a tangent about females. The school no longer teaches the morals and ideals it once taught. The school is losing its values. I love The Citadel, and have been a supporter. It saddens me that The Citadel has taken the path it has. It has turned its back on the graduates from days past. I am greatful for the experience The Citadel gave me. I have become a better person living the ideals the school once enstilled into its cadets. It is intolerable what the school has allowed.